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Which two resolution choices are you voting for?
A. The United States Federal Government should substantially reform its policies toward Mexico or one or more countries in Central America. 3%  3%  [ 2 ]
B. The United States Federal Government should substantially reform its policies toward the People’s Republic of China. 23%  23%  [ 17 ]
C. That the United States should substantially reform its foreign military presence. 24%  24%  [ 18 ]
A. In the interest of protecting human rights, governments may interfere with another nation’s sovereignty. 11%  11%  [ 8 ]
B. That interpreting the United States Constitution according to its original meaning is preferable to interpreting it as a living document. 8%  8%  [ 6 ]
C. Rehabilitation ought to be valued above retribution in criminal justice systems. 31%  31%  [ 23 ]
Total votes: 74
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2016 2:37 am 
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^With the above comment in mind, I do think that it therefore makes more sense to chose the China resolution (If you are stuck between A and B) because perhaps the two most relevant issues with Resolution A (Immigration and Drugs) would not make for a real meaningful debate.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2016 3:13 am 
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Seabass00 wrote:
atshelton wrote:
First of all, even though I'm not in favor of the first resolution it seems a little narrow to say that it would only be about drugs and immigration

We don't have very many other prominent policies with Mexico or Central America besides immigration and drugs, so either those cases will be the focus or the proposals will be insignificant.

Prominence =/= significance in any way. Just because all you hear about Central America in the 30 second sound bite news clips is immigration and drugs doesn't mean that's the most significant or only significant policy the US has with those countries. For example, the US exports about twice as much to Mexico as to China and Mexico is the US's third largest trading partner. There's about equal amount of reform that could occur to our trade with Mexico as could occur with China. Of course we don't usually realize this because all we think is "immigration and drugs." This is why a resolution on this would be highly educational for the vast majority of NCFCA debaters. Though I still agree with you that this could become dull but for the same reasons that China could as well.

Seabass00 wrote:
atshelton wrote:
Second of all most people in NCFCA who are competing in TP now didn't debate in immigration year so it doesn't really matter since that is still an important issue to know about

But it is an issue that most people are familiar with, so debating that resolution would have less educational value than either B or C, where we don't know as much about the issues and the resolutions covers more policy topics. Comparatively A is worse.

I think you give people a little too much credit here. While it is true that more people have strong preformed opinions about immigration this doesn't mean they've already done the research necessary to debate about it in an informed and knowledgable manner. This is true for a lot of NCFCA resolutions and isn't a negative really. Most NCFCAers had preformed opinions on Voter ID laws going into election law year and on the UN going into UN year. Did that make the resolutions any worse? Not at all.

Seabass00 wrote:
atshelton wrote:
And to say that C is boring just because we've talked about military stuff during the middle east and UN resolutions also doesn't make sense.

The point isn't solely that we have already debated it as much as it is that the resolution is focused around one type of policy that will largely be debated for or against the same way the whole year long (isolation vs intervention, diplomacy vs force). This makes researching and debating A far less interesting when compared to debating B which spans more types of policy, making research and debate more interesting. I would - however - say that it is probably more fair to phrase it "B is more interesting than C" not necessarily "C is boring."

While you could simply take the stance of interventionist / isolationist every round, I doubt any debaters would do this and be successful with it. You could technically do the same thing with China. Engagement with China good/bad generics. I think this is mostly dependent on preference and what each individual thinks is interesting. I personally found (and still find) US military and defense policy around the world to be extremely interesting and impactful. You can impact almost every round to the lives of American citizens (aka judges), and I think that makes it more interesting.I highly doubt this would be nearly as frequent with the China resolution when you're talking about the tariff rate we put on their tires. Some people might not see it this way though and that's fine.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2016 2:36 pm 
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atshelton wrote:
Prominence =/= significance in any way. Just because all you hear about Central America in the 30 second sound bite news clips is immigration and drugs doesn't mean that's the most significant or only significant policy the US has with those countries. For example, the US exports about twice as much to Mexico as to China and Mexico is the US's third largest trading partner. There's about equal amount of reform that could occur to our trade with Mexico as could occur with China. Of course we don't usually realize this because all we think is "immigration and drugs."

I think I must clarify. My point is that resolution A is much narrower than either of the other two resolutions and that prominent/interesting reforms under it seem harder to come by than with the other two resolutions. I illustrated this point by identifying two reforms that I see as likely to by overused and the focus of the year with resolutions A. You are treating all my arguments as good or bad, true or false, hot or cold, when in reality I am trying to illustrate that resolution A is comparatively more narrow and less interesting than either B or C. I feel like B, especially, offers a variety of prominent, impactful, and interesting reforms that span multiple foreign policy topics. In summary the reason we bring up the fact that immigration and drugs will be the focus of a year with resolution A is to point out that it is narrower and less interesting than the other two options (not necessarily that immigration and drugs would literally be the only things we debate).
atshelton wrote:
I think you give people a little too much credit here. While it is true that more people have strong preformed opinions about immigration this doesn't mean they've already done the research necessary to debate about it in an informed and knowledgable manner. This is true for a lot of NCFCA resolutions and isn't a negative really. Most NCFCAers had preformed opinions on Voter ID laws going into election law year and on the UN going into UN year. Did that make the resolutions any worse? Not at all.

Sure! We have allot of preformed opinions about almost every resolution and (by your logic) every resolution is educational (which I agree to by the way). My point is that a year of resolution B or C would be comparatively more interesting and more educational because (at least with B) there are more policies that we could/should learn more about than under A and the policies span a variety of different foreign policy topics (cyber security, military presence, human rights, trade, intellectual property, climate change, etc). Once again we are comparing resolutions so I am only trying to prove that A is comparatively less interesting, less broad, and less educational, not that it is totally void of interesting content, or that immigration and drugs would be the only cases run, or that we wouldn't learn anything.
atshelton wrote:
While you could simply take the stance of interventionist / isolationist every round, I doubt any debaters would do this and be successful with it. You could technically do the same thing with China. Engagement with China good/bad generics.

Here is the difference. All the cases under resolution C will revolve around the fundamental topic of military presence making the underlying arguments in every round very similar. With China we would debate many different types of foreign policy (see what I listed in my last response under this comment) making the fundamental arguments in every round different. It will at the very least be more interesting and more variant than arguments under C.
atshelton wrote:
I think this is mostly dependent on preference and what each individual thinks is interesting

I totally agree to that. I find resolution B more interesting because we would get to learn about allot of different types of foreign policy and we would get to explore allot of different issues (as I have already listed this would include military presence, cyber security, human rights, trade, intellectual property, climate change, and more). I think research is central to Team Policy and if I am going to do allot of research I would prefer that it is on a variety of topics because that keeps things interesting for me to research and argue. But yeah, this is of course largely going to be a matter of opinion.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2016 10:31 pm 
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WHAT
THE STOA 2012 REZ: Resolved: The United States Federal Government should substantially reform its foreign military presence and/or foreign military commitments

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2016 12:46 am 
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_idontknow_ wrote:
WHAT
THE STOA 2012 REZ: Resolved: The United States Federal Government should substantially reform its foreign military presence and/or foreign military commitments

Yeah, I mentioned this earlier. I actually debated in Stoa that year and loved it so I'm happy that NCFCA has realized it's greatness and stolen it. Of the six TP resolutions that I researched and debated the military one was my second favorite overall and definitely my favorite foreign policy one.


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2016 8:01 am 
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OH WOW AND THE NCDA 2010-2011 REZ WAS FOREIGN MILITARY/POLICE PRESENCE.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2016 12:48 pm 
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^All this affirming that topic C is overdone and we need to do something new (like rez B). ;)

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2016 11:17 pm 
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Just to add my two cents:

TP Res B sounds like a solid topic, and covers new research territory. Res C could be exciting, but Aff's would be pulling so many squirrels it'll be nuts. :P And if Trump becomes President (a good possibility), Res A would just be ... interesting.

LD Res C sounds awesome. I would totally debate that topic. With Res B, it might sound cool, but I doubt that it will be fun in round. And A, it's too stale of a topic. We've already done that before; it's overdone.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2016 9:13 pm 
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My (albeit imperfect, of course :D) perspective on the LD resolution choices.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2016 11:17 pm 
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I wrote a thing for Ethos on the TP resolutions if anyone is interested.

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Ethos is also pretty cool, you should check it out.


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2016 11:28 pm 
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_TakenUsername_ wrote:

Thorough, well put.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 15, 2016 7:06 am 
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I was sooooo expecting a rick roll XD ^

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