homeschool debate | Forums Wiki

HomeSchoolDebate

Speech and Debate Resources and Community
Forums      Wiki
It is currently Tue Oct 24, 2017 12:24 pm
Not a member? Guests can only see part of the forums. To see the whole thing (and add your voice!), just register a free account by following these steps.

All times are UTC+01:00




Post new topic  Reply to topic  [ 34 posts ]  Go to page 1 2 Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 4:58 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Nov 06, 2010 12:42 am
Posts: 44
Home Schooled: Yes
Location: Region 6
Well, this is interesting. I'm interested in whether the application process would allow leadership to block students they would rather not have in the position. That said, this is, on its face, a very good step.

_________________
click for details
14-15: Churchman/Wright
19-20
15-16: Churchman/Kauk
46-20

WI Open: 7-1 | 6-0 | 5th
KY: 4-3 | 4-2 | 12th
NC Open: 9-3 | 4-2 | 2nd
WI: 7-1 | 6-0 | 5th
OH: 4-3 | 4-2 | 13th
IL: 5-3 | 4-2 | 7th
Regionals: 5-4 | 3-3 | 4th
Nats: 6-2 | 5-1 | 5th

now coaching
top12gun@gmail.com
-
Chapman/Chapman


Top
   
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 5:14 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Sep 01, 2013 7:13 pm
Posts: 471
Home Schooled: Yes
Location: Purcellville, VA
I'm a bit torn on this.

On the one hand, it seems like a step in the right direction. NCFCA needs more student input.

On the other hand, if students with "controversial" opinions (e.g. people who disagree with some things NCFCA does) are not allowed on the panel, then chances are little to no change will result. In fact, if only students who approve of everything NCFCA does are allowed on the panel, then I think it would make matters worse. Policies and actions would be given the stamp of student approval when in actuality the only support was from those who believe NCFCA can do no wrong.

It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

EDIT: I'm rather amused that this is one of the application questions: "What forms of social media and online forums do you actively use or participate in? Please include user names, links, profiles, etc." I'm guessing anyone who has criticized NCFCA on HSD is out. XP

_________________
RIX Alum | Patrick Henry College | Class of 2019


Top
   
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 5:48 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 14, 2008 9:28 pm
Posts: 2888
Home Schooled: Yes
Location: I'm not lost! I'm locationally challenged. -John M. Ford
Quote:
I agree to always represent NCFCA honorably, even if I don’t personally agree with the specific rule, policy or decision.

I'm not sure this could be written any more vaguely. The fact that this exists indicates to me they're more interested representation from the board to the students than input from students to the board.

EDIT: to be fair, I don't think that's a bad thing--it's the right direction. Some communication is better than none.

_________________
There cannot be a crisis next week. My schedule is already full.
- Henry Kissinger


Top
   
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 5:56 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2015 1:57 am
Posts: 124
Home Schooled: Yes
Location: Check your fridge.
I definitely think it's a step in the right direction. Admittedly, I'm not one of those who has had any real concerns with NCFCA leadership in the past, but at the very least this program should provide students with greater understanding of how the leadership structure works in the first place.

_________________
Benjamin Vincent, RII Alum
Biola University '21
www.lifeinthesunrise.com

"Everything in this world is either a potato... or not a potato."


Top
   
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 6:18 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 18, 2013 3:01 am
Posts: 651
Home Schooled: Yes
Location: Flying a UFO to an undisclosed location ;)
This makes me happy. In the very least it will get the ball rolling for change (though I don't think dramatic change is needed). I'd be interested to see more of how the council will be implemented and what sort of sway they will have on the NCFCA board with decisions.
In a way it's like it's own scholarship too, it's a resume builder for sure.

_________________
John Mark Porter, Alumni
Arx Axiom/Carpe Dictum/Verdict/UADC/HSDC/HSDRC

2011-12 l Porter/Thomason, Light/Porter
2012-13 l Bailey/Porter
2013-14 l Bailey/Porter
2014-15 l Folkert/Porter

2015-16 I Childs/Porter


Top
   
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 6:27 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2012 3:47 pm
Posts: 1377
Home Schooled: Yes
Location: H*wL*tt P*ck*rd muffins
marinadelayne wrote:
On the other hand, if students with "controversial" opinions (e.g. people who disagree with some things NCFCA does) are not allowed on the panel, then chances are little to no change will result. In fact, if only students who approve of everything NCFCA does are allowed on the panel, then I think it would make matters worse. Policies and actions would be given the stamp of student approval when in actuality the only support was from those who believe NCFCA can do no wrong.

This is an advisory council, not a veto committee. The correct path by NCFCA would be to find students who would fulfill the job of representing their region, students who share the general feelings of their region instead of their personal views.

_________________
-Joshua
The dumb Boatswain's Mate who once did debate
Proud Coastie, Puddle Pirate, and Shallow Water Sailor


Top
   
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 8:03 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jun 25, 2015 2:17 pm
Posts: 59
Home Schooled: Yes
I agree with Ben and Joshua (EDIT: and John Mark, sorry man missed your post :P), this is a big step forward and most definitely in the right direction. NCFCA has the support of the majority of it's students (including me) even if we may differ on certain issues. This committee 1: gives the students involved a direct line to NCFCA leadership but 2: and I think even more importantly it gives other students in the region a student advocate. Someone who is a friend/peer/mentor of a lot of other competitors in their region and is therefore more approachable. Ultimately, I think it will lead to more discussion of controversial issues and a better understanding of all the parties involved in the league.

Long Justification :P
As I've interacted with Mrs. Teresa over my 4 years in the league (all in her home region of R7 so I see her quite often) I see someone who really wants the best for the league and by that I don't mean what makes everybody happy/making the popular decisions I mean someone who is focused on the mission statement of the league, someone who honors God with her life and with her leadership and someone who has a vested interest in the students of the league. Are there things in the league that need to be addressed? Obviously. That is why this council was created. That is why I hope to be apart of the council at some point. But is this council a means of hiding abuse and justifying terrible decision? Not in any way, shape, or form. I am saddened when people make hasty assumption about any and every decision the board of directors makes. They really do have our best interests in mind, as long as our interests are glorifying God. Questionable decisions are not a reason to condemn just a reason to ask questions. And so far every answer I have heard has been well thought out and justified. The student council, if it did nothing else at all, would at least give us more (and more thought out) answers. Basically a better understanding of both sides of the issue by both sides. I highly doubt that is all the council is therefore (in fact, I 99% positive it will be super awesome for the league) but I really don't see how this could be a bad thing at all.

Basically, the student council should be an awesome step for the league. and I can't wait to see who is selected.

_________________
Hammy wrote:
Noah is right


Top
   
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 8:17 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2015 1:57 am
Posts: 124
Home Schooled: Yes
Location: Check your fridge.
^^^^ So much everything Noah just said. ^^^^

_________________
Benjamin Vincent, RII Alum
Biola University '21
www.lifeinthesunrise.com

"Everything in this world is either a potato... or not a potato."


Top
   
PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2016 1:24 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2014 7:11 pm
Posts: 14
Home Schooled: Yes
This council appears to have less actual influence that North Korea's parliament. I foresee few changes in the future as a result of this; expect NCFCA's leadership to remain just as disconnected and needlessly authoritarian as its been for the past several years.

_________________
Joel Brejda - Region V

2013-2014: Brejda/Kelley (qualified to regionals)
2014-2015: Brejda/Wismer (1st at regionals; 2-4 at nationals)

Region V Bracketgate 2015 - Never Forget


Top
   
PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2016 1:55 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2013 4:55 am
Posts: 211
Home Schooled: Yes
Location: VA
Don't knock it before it's had a chance to get off the ground. It can't really hurt. :) I agree, the cynic in me thought "this board is about as useful as a screen door on a submarine." But at the same time, it is a step towards transparency, accountability, and student involvement (not things that the NCFCA lacks entirely, but ideals that we should be striving toward.) Ultimately, I'm pretty happy about it. I hope the NCFCA leadership is open to the input that these students provide.

_________________
NCFCA Region IX (FASD)

Reagan Bass/Justin Moffatt '12-'16


Retired.


Top
   
PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2016 4:04 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2008 4:07 pm
Posts: 1267
Home Schooled: Yes
Quote:
"What forms of social media and online forums do you actively use or participate in? Please include user names, links, profiles, etc."


I wouldn't give this info for a paying job let alone a volunteer advisory position :P

_________________
I have gone to find myself. If I get back before I return, keep me here.


Top
   
PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2016 4:09 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Oct 23, 2012 2:27 am
Posts: 635
Home Schooled: Yes
Db8r_from_Dixie wrote:
Quote:
"What forms of social media and online forums do you actively use or participate in? Please include user names, links, profiles, etc."


I wouldn't give this info for a paying job let alone a volunteer advisory position :P

This question makes perfect sense. In a paid job it would totally make sense for the employer to view your social media feeds and see what kind of stuff you post, share, etc. Why the heck wouldn't you put that info on there?

_________________
:lol:


Top
   
PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2016 4:55 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2015 1:57 am
Posts: 124
Home Schooled: Yes
Location: Check your fridge.
Look, the council doesn't even exist yet, people. It makes absolutely no sense to be bashing it before its even been established. The thing is, many of you ["you" meaning HSD'ers in general] have been complaining about supposedly "authoritarian" NCFCA policies for years, yet clearly some of you would rather just sit and mope than see actual change. The day the NCFCA actually puts into place a system designed to increase transparency and provide a route for student input, your first response is to assume it will be useless.

67% percent of respondents on the "The Time Has Come: Much Needed Reform" poll said that they believe NCFCA should make "specific reforms." People gave reasons like these:

LocutusofBorg wrote:
The board doesn't respond to student input.


VoiceofPeople wrote:
And how can we talk about United States elections, when we have no representation in the organization we must be submissive of?


And suggested fixes like these:

Anne wrote:
I do not think that the students should have the final say in the decisions that are made, but I think that students should still be more involved than they are right now. The students are the ones that are ultimately affected by every decision made in the league, so I don't see any problem with letting the students having more of a voice in decision-making.


VoiceofPeople wrote:
the voice of the students must be heard and heeded by NCFCA administration.


I understand if you feel that the NCFCA leadership should work differently. You're certainly entitled to your opinion. But there is absolutely no logical reason for you to be attacking the league's attempt to do the very things you people have been asking the league to do for years.

TL;DR: In general, I think the wise thing would be to wait until the council actually exists and has been operating for a while before making any specific judgments about its functionality. It could very well help with the issues some people have had in the past.

_________________
Benjamin Vincent, RII Alum
Biola University '21
www.lifeinthesunrise.com

"Everything in this world is either a potato... or not a potato."


Top
   
PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2016 8:30 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2014 7:11 pm
Posts: 14
Home Schooled: Yes
I wouldn't be knocking it if I thought it could serve any purpose other than serving as an echo chamber for NCFCA's current policies.

_________________
Joel Brejda - Region V

2013-2014: Brejda/Kelley (qualified to regionals)
2014-2015: Brejda/Wismer (1st at regionals; 2-4 at nationals)

Region V Bracketgate 2015 - Never Forget


Top
   
PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2016 2:06 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 17, 2014 12:21 am
Posts: 35
Home Schooled: Yes
Location: Running
Teddy_Roosevelt wrote:
I wouldn't be knocking it if I thought it could serve any purpose other than serving as an echo chamber for NCFCA's current policies.

I think his point is that you're jumping to irrational conclusions and being unreasonable. Nobody can say one way or the other. Another point he made is that you people have been calling for this kind of thing for a while, so quit whining and be happy until you've at least actually seen it. If it fails, feel free to tell me you told me so. Until then, I think it would be prudent to talk about something else.

_________________
Region VII - AL
Poythress B/Poythress P (Criminal Justice) 2012
Hurst B/Poythress P - (United Nations) 2013
Poythress B/Poythress P - (Election Law) 2014
Poythress B/Poythress P - (Middle East) 2015
Hudson W/Poythress P - (Court Reform) 2016
Poythress P/Roberts J - (China) 2017


Top
   
PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2016 7:24 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 18, 2013 3:01 am
Posts: 651
Home Schooled: Yes
Location: Flying a UFO to an undisclosed location ;)
Teddy_Roosevelt wrote:
I wouldn't be knocking it if I thought it could serve any purpose other than serving as an echo chamber for NCFCA's current policies.

I don't really see what you guys were expecting to have happen. Did you want the NCFCA to all of a sudden say "Hey, what's with this whole President/Board thing? Why don't we just abolish it and leave it up to the individual regions to figure it all out?" If you are advocating for a reform, then let things happen slowly. Reform is a process.

_________________
John Mark Porter, Alumni
Arx Axiom/Carpe Dictum/Verdict/UADC/HSDC/HSDRC

2011-12 l Porter/Thomason, Light/Porter
2012-13 l Bailey/Porter
2013-14 l Bailey/Porter
2014-15 l Folkert/Porter

2015-16 I Childs/Porter


Top
   
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 4:47 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue May 01, 2012 1:58 am
Posts: 244
Home Schooled: Yes
Location: do I want you to know...?
The big problem is I don't think Mrs. Hudson would want somebody who truly represents the body politic in region 5.

Voice of Reason wrote:
I don't really see what you guys were expecting to have happen. Did you want the NCFCA to all of a sudden say "Hey, what's with this whole President/Board thing? Why don't we just abolish it and leave it up to the individual regions to figure it all out?" If you are advocating for a reform, then let things happen slowly. Reform is a process.


Oh no I was expecting something like this. My expectations for NCFCA have always been low, though.

And I have to say, as Americans with our history and our heritage, I think we have the right to say "No, this isn't working. Either change now or we're out." It would be, dare I say, unpatriotic for Mrs. Hudson to expect anything less of us.

_________________
Jonathan Meckel || Nebraska || NCFCA Boycotter. #BracketGate #BracketLivesMatter
Free at last, they took your life, they could not take your pride


Top
   
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 5:35 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2012 3:47 pm
Posts: 1377
Home Schooled: Yes
Location: H*wL*tt P*ck*rd muffins
mountain dude wrote:
And I have to say, as Americans with our history and our heritage, I think we have the right to say "No, this isn't working. Either change now or we're out."

No offense, but you have a very poor understanding of American History if you view it as being a simple matter of "this isn't working." The issues surrounding American Independence were substantially more pressing than even the best grievances against NCFCA I've ever seen anyone present.

Also, you did leave NCFCA. :P While I would view such strong negative sentiments to be unfounded and irrational, if you do feel that strongly, then yes, get out.

_________________
-Joshua
The dumb Boatswain's Mate who once did debate
Proud Coastie, Puddle Pirate, and Shallow Water Sailor


Last edited by Hammy on Fri Apr 22, 2016 6:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
   
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 5:54 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Mar 14, 2016 5:14 pm
Posts: 51
Home Schooled: Yes
Hammy wrote:
The issues surrounding American Independence were substantially more pressing than even the best grievances I've ever seen anyone present.

I Second That.
P.S. Except for maybe Michael Farris. He does a pretty good job in his Constitutional Literacy class.

_________________
- Joshua Beckman
Region X

Beckman/Hopkins 2015-2016
LD 2016-2017
Ellerslie Discipleship Training Summer 2017
http://www.ellerslie.com


Top
   
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 6:42 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2012 3:47 pm
Posts: 1377
Home Schooled: Yes
Location: H*wL*tt P*ck*rd muffins
sons_of_thunder wrote:
Hammy wrote:
The issues surrounding American Independence were substantially more pressing than even the best grievances I've ever seen anyone present.

I Second That.
P.S. Except for maybe Michael Farris. He does a pretty good job in his Constitutional Literacy class.

Whoops, what I meant is when compared to any of the arguments that people present against NCFCA. But now that you mention it, you're right. Michael Farris has done the best job that I've seen. :)

_________________
-Joshua
The dumb Boatswain's Mate who once did debate
Proud Coastie, Puddle Pirate, and Shallow Water Sailor


Top
   
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic  Reply to topic  [ 34 posts ]  Go to page 1 2 Next

All times are UTC+01:00


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Limited