homeschool debate | Forums Wiki

HomeSchoolDebate

Speech and Debate Resources and Community
Forums      Wiki
It is currently Sat Nov 25, 2017 4:59 am
Not a member? Guests can only see part of the forums. To see the whole thing (and add your voice!), just register a free account by following these steps.

All times are UTC+01:00




Forum locked  This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 25 posts ]  Go to page Previous 1 2
Author Message
PostPosted: Tue Mar 01, 2011 7:15 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jun 06, 2008 5:25 pm
Posts: 469
Home Schooled: Yes
In TP I recall it is pretty important. If the aff plan has a hangup so that it doesn't work, isn't needed, won't solve, etc, then it shouldn't be passed. Correct me if I'm wrong, policy debaters, that's knowledge from 3 years ago.

LD... it has become more prevalent lately, but I don't see why. Drops are only important if they actually address key issues. If a debater didn't have enough time to explain how his resolutional philosophy applies to another application, it doesn't mean that his entire standpoint is wrong. It is actually pretty effective to acknowledge your opponent's observation that you dropped an argument, apologize for it, then proceed to convince the judge why you believe your position is so strong that ceding that point doesn't make a difference.

So drops are ok in LD in my opinion. If you are going to point out drops, impact and show why it matters. Obviously you can't just drop because you didn't want to address a tough point, but if minor things fall by the wayside, so be it. The important thing is whether or not the argument matters, and if the lack of addressing it impacts the round.

_________________
"You are a sad, strange little man, and you have my pity. Farewell!" - Buzz Lightyear, Toy Story


Top
   
PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 9:07 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2008 9:54 pm
Posts: 838
Home Schooled: Yes
Location: Southern California
A drop matters if the argument matters.

_________________
For Coaches: Download 6 free editions of Dominate cases and articles


Top
   
PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 2:12 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Aug 07, 2010 3:02 am
Posts: 635
Home Schooled: Yes
Location: South Carolina
ldrox wrote:
A drop matters if the argument matters.

Thanks for summing everything up so succinctly :)
...as a 1AR myself, I employ this kinda framework pretty often.

_________________
God judged it better to bring good out of evil than to suffer no evil to exist.
- Saint Augustine


Top
   
PostPosted: Fri Mar 04, 2011 3:21 pm 
Offline
Epicness at its awesomest
User avatar

Joined: Wed Aug 20, 2008 11:20 pm
Posts: 866
Home Schooled: Yes
Location: The Party Region (R8ght)
ldrox put it best, but to expound on it a little bit more,


Aff has a [totally imaginary] case with a goal of completely solving HR in Russia.
Neg, among other things, runs 3 DA's that are a complete HR turn that has the final impact of Russia sinking into anarchy and chaos. This is hammered completely in the in the neg block.
1AR doesn't respond.
2NR turns the DA's into a voting issue.
2AR responds with some cheap and only semi-factual response about the links.


The arguments are fictitious, but the framework is definitely not - the most common thing I hear about non-experienced teams is "Due to 1ar time constraints, my partner will address this in his 2ar." [Heck, I had no club or coach at all so that used to be ME my first year.] This is an example of where drops totally matter. The 2NR is supposed to be the chance to make the final neg responses and then condense into "Here's the bottom line" for the judge - for the aff to wait until the bottom line is made, a bottom line that is ROOTED in "They have no response" and then responding in the 2AR to uproot the foundation of the argument so artificially is wrong and abusive. Every neg that makes a dropped arg a voting issue is going to MAKE one of the main thrusts of the VI the fact that it was dropped; for an aff to wait for that groundwork to be laid and then go "::really quick five second response that doesn't actually rebut so much as pick the argument back up and play with it:: WE RESPONDED! AHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHA" isn't chill at all.

However, on the flip side, if you are going to make dropped args a big deal, always remember to impact them, don't just go "btw, no response on this lol" - Typically what I do is condense all the dropped arguments into one voting issue consisting of whatever they were designed to attack, if that makes sense. The key isn't so much "they dropped this so we/I win", it's "They dropped this argument. This argument was significant because of ______."
Always impact out the ARGUMENT, not the DROP, and then the drop will become significant.

_________________
Some days, words are not enough.

- Five year alumni turned debate coach.


Top
   
PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 6:37 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 30, 2008 2:35 pm
Posts: 2441
Home Schooled: Yes
Location: Omaha, NE
^^Of course, under a stock issues paradigm that could be a problem. One drop can easily be impacted to a terminal solvency/harms/inherency takeout. Under a net benefits paradigm you'll very rarely win on those drops, except one IPDA round I had where the girl conceded inherency in CX (oops). Under stock issues, though, the judge has to vote neg.

One of the many reasons the aff should never submit to a stock issues paradigm. Even if its in the harms/solvency structure, run it net benefits.

_________________
-Bryan
Co-Founder of Olympus Forensics

Google it, we're the second link that pops up. We're pretty proud of that.


Top
   
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Forum locked  This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 25 posts ]  Go to page Previous 1 2

All times are UTC+01:00


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Limited